My twist on Collin's core of 4 - Printable Version+- Pokemon Forever (http://pokemonforever.com)
+-- Forum: POKéMON (http://pokemonforever.com/Forum-POK%C3%A9MON)
+--- Forum: Competitive Pokemon Discussion (http://pokemonforever.com/Forum-Competitive-Pokemon-Discussion)
+---- Forum: Competitive Discussion Archive (http://pokemonforever.com/Forum-Competitive-Discussion-Archive)
+---- Thread:
My twist on Collin's core of 4 (/Thread-VGC-My-twist-on-Collin-s-core-of-4)My twist on Collin's core of 4 - Pokeventurer - Jul 13, 2015
Hey guys i am back with another post, this time i will be discussing a editted core of Collin heier's which he used in a very popular team of his. this is still quite an unfinished post with "unefficient EV spreads and even move options". core is pretty much almost solid, however i converted his half-and-half TR and normal speed core into all out trick room. i ran some tests with the core with the last two slots filled up and it works out quite alot better than i expected, first i will give you guys a look at collin's core (not the whole team) and then my own will come. let's get started:
![[Image: sylveon.gif]](http://www.pokestadium.com/sprites/xy/sylveon.gif)
Sylveon @ Life Orb
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 164 HP / 108 Def / 192 SpA / 4 SpD / 40 Spe
Modest Nature
– Hyper Voice
– Protect
– Calm Mind
– Hidden Power [Fire]
![[Image: salamence.gif]](http://www.pokestadium.com/sprites/xy/salamence.gif)
Salamence @ Salamencite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpD / 244 Spe
Adamant Nature
– Return
– Protect
– Earthquake
– Draco Meteor
![[Image: rhyperior.gif]](http://www.pokestadium.com/sprites/xy/rhyperior.gif)
Rhyperior @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 132 HP / 172 Atk / 44 Def / 156 SpD / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 31 Spe
– Protect
– Drill Run
– Rock Slide
– Earthquake
![[Image: cresselia.gif]](http://www.pokestadium.com/sprites/xy/cresselia.gif)
Cresselia (F) @ Rocky Helmet / Mental Herb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Def / 148 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
– Toxic
– Ice Beam
– Trick Room
– Helping Hand
Collin's personal thoughts on the core:
"These four Pokemon were the four I brought almost every game. I felt like the synergy between these four stood out so much that I needed to mention it. I felt that with these four, I could handle almost any team. I had a convincing non-Trick Room mode with Salamence and Sylveon, and a very threatening Trick Room mode with Rhyperior and Cresselia. I have been playing Trick Room since the beginning of my competitive career. Trick Room makes the most sense logically, why run any speed if you can run all attack and bulk? Salamence also was able to function in Trick Room if I needed him to because of his exceptional mega bulk. Sylveon and Rhyperior were able to really shine with Cresselia and Salamence supporting them."
My Core:
Cresselia @ Mental Herb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 136 Def / 120 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Helping Hand
- Ice Beam
- Skill Swap
So this is the first member of my core, It's EV spread is copied from Collin's cress, except for the skill swap, on this specific team/core the threat for bulky water types like rotom-w, ludicolo and politoed is much reduced, so i never though of toxic as a solid slot for cress. Skill swap has importance for disrupting other's strategies as well as making my own strong. people often keep rain dance on politoed or keep playing smart, switch out into my weather, by using skill swap i can do much better at games by re-activating the drought and turning weather in my favor. Ice beam does much more for backing up threats like lando-t to charizard. Cresselia's helping hand with tons of spread moves on my was an awesome option to go for.
![[Image: golem.gif]](http://www.pokestadium.com/sprites/xy/golem.gif)
Golem @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake
- Wide Guard
- Protect
Second pokemon is golem, which obviously is replaced over rhyperior. i did this so as i felt two of the following reasons: it has the sturdy ability which can help me survive any attack for one turn atleast, still being able to attack atleaset once with the weakness policy boost. the second reason was that i wanted someone or something to use the move wide guard, which rhyperior can't ever, golem pairs up nicely with it's wide guard protecting mainly charizard y from rock slides that income. It's EV spread is underdeveloped, as it needs to survive many attacks. it also has a base ten higher sp.def stat but that really doesn't counts. Golem's spread attacks are further benifitted by cresselia. having two pokemons immune to ground alone makes me use EQ more often.
Sylveon @ Life Orb
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 164 HP / 108 Def / 236 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 0 Spe
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Calm Mind
- Protect
The third member of the team is pretty much the same. i changed it's EV spread as Collin was investing in all five stats except attack. i avoided doing so as investing in speed would make it uneasy to use in TR environment and investing further in 4 stats always results in a waste of EV's. sylvie can survive almost any sp.atk, ofcourse with calm mind adding to it. I swapped HP fire for psyshock with the increased threat of amoongus after salamence, and basically increased threat of venusaur and even breloom, in short powder moves.
![[Image: charizard-megay.gif]](http://www.pokestadium.com/sprites/xy/charizard-megay.gif)
Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 212 HP / 44 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Flamethrower
- Ancient Power
- Solar Beam
- Protect
As this is a quartz core, we can't leave till the mega. charizard was my substitution for salamence. I basically thought of putting charizard as the fourth member after the popular mega gardevoir in TR with a base 100 speed stat. charizard can underspeed almost anything (except other trick roomers) and deals tons of damage in TR. it's synergy with the overall core is soo amazing, minimal speed investments are obvious. ancient power is to counter mirror-matches but a better move can be suggested by you guys. This core is extremely solid in my opinion and almost nothing can beat it if you play it safe. Flamethrower needs an explanation: more damage than spread moves, good offense against aegislash (specially this specific core), 100% accuracy with the awesome rain boost. doesn't accidently or forcefully activates any flash fires. Solarbeam further reduces threat of water types.
Teambuild options:
As there were two slots left i decided first to go for a mon with safety goggles,i thought for heatran to increase the "firepower" but it really didn't suited my style. i was looking for flying types to further check grass mons,and then came the best mon Honchkrow which can deal both amazingly, thanks to the amazing power and the insomnia ability. it also gives dark coverage for psychic types and ghosts too. superpower is a strong counter for both baiting and defeating tyranitar.
![[Image: honchkrow.gif]](http://www.pokestadium.com/sprites/xy/honchkrow.gif)
Honchkrow @ Choice Band
Ability: Insomnia
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Sucker Punch
- Superpower
- Night Slash
Rotom's spread is something i am quite unsure of. it's moves too, i never really needed a status move and dicharge with golem givesme the awesome disquake combination, which did worked out quite well in some games. rotom was basically putted on to cover against more water types and also rotom-h and heatran that can wall charizard in many situations. Volt switch again was the third check on weather insurance. i do need a bulky rotom spread, i'll try the calm nature one since sylveon can hit my team hard, can anyone give me the calm natured spread plz?
![[Image: rotom-wash.gif]](http://www.pokestadium.com/sprites/xy/rotom-wash.gif)
Rotom-Wash @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
- Volt Switch
- Hydro Pump
- Discharge
- Protect
Here are some battle videos for you guys to see:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotdoublesvgc2015-249206937
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotdoublesvgc2015-249207590
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotdoublesvgc2015-249208243
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotdoublesvgc2015-249208853
Conclusion:
first of all thanks to all of you guys for reading throught the post, and btw sorry if i didn't choose the right prefix as this post became a part RMT and part Disscussion thing,soi felt VGC was the way to go for it. if someone wants some additional info on any mon or the team in general feel free, plz leave tons of suggestions for me and plz be friendly and respectful in your statements. Bye for now![/b]
RE: My twist on Collin's core of 4 - Marcusube - Jul 13, 2015
If it's an unfinished post then why post it now and not complete it. Also, not everyone knows what Collin's team looks like so it would be good to at least give us a link to an article or list the members of his team.
Overall not a bad team. As you said, the EV spreads are still not developed so you need to look into that. My question is, what is your response if you cannot get Trick Room up? You only have one setter which means you would have to carry it even in matchups against threats such as Hydreigon, Aegislash and Bisharp. Since most of your mons are slow, it might be an issue to take out these threats.
RE: My twist on Collin's core of 4 - Pokeventurer - Jul 13, 2015
(Jul 13, 2015, 06:55 AM)Marcusube Wrote: If it's an unfinished post then why post it now and not complete it. Also, not everyone knows what Collin's team looks like so it would be good to at least give us a link to an article or list the members of his team.
Overall not a bad team. As you said, the EV spreads are still not developed so you need to look into that. My question is, what is your response if you cannot get Trick Room up? You only have one setter which means you would have to carry it even in matchups against threats such as Hydreigon, Aegislash and Bisharp. Since most of your mons are slow, it might be an issue to take out these threats.
I think you misunderstood the sense of "unfinished post" it was in terms of the EV spreads and not surity of the team i will put around it.
As your question is concerned: mental herb is a counter to every taunting threat. my team has plenty of counters to things like bisharp and aegi (charizard with flamethrower, further golem's EQ and honcho too) hydreigon's worst nightmare would be sylveon for sure. since i have most bulk investments my mons are surely are going to survive atleast one attack, while they still pack the potential to deal back heavy damage and even OHKO