"I'm on Cloud Nine like a-Golduck?" Shedding light on a very useful VGC16 ability. - Printable Version +- Pokemon Forever (http://pokemonforever.com) +-- Forum: POKéMON (http://pokemonforever.com/Forum-POK%C3%A9MON) +--- Forum: Competitive Pokemon Discussion (http://pokemonforever.com/Forum-Competitive-Pokemon-Discussion) +--- Thread: "I'm on Cloud Nine like a-Golduck?" Shedding light on a very useful VGC16 ability. (/Thread-VGC-I-m-on-Cloud-Nine-like-a-Golduck-Shedding-light-on-a-very-useful-VGC16-ability)

"I'm on Cloud Nine like a-Golduck?" Shedding light on a very useful VGC16 ability. - MagnusHexem - Jan 20, 2016 I've run over so many ideas of Cloud Nine in this format, so I thought that I'd spill them all out here. If you don't know, Cloud Nine is an ability that removes all weather effects.  That's right, all of them.  Tired of Mega Rayquaza's living Ice Beams?  Annoyed that Groudon doesn't care about your water moves?  Well, then, you should go on Cloud Nine!  When a Pokemon with Cloud Nine is on the field, the weather doesn't matter.  With over half of teams carrying Groudon, and many others carrying Kyogre and Rayquaza, this ability will be a lot more useful than it was in past formats. In this thread, I am going to be going over the three [fully-evolved] Pokemon that get access to this ability, their uses, and why they can be great additions to teams struggling with the big weather conditions that will be dominating this format.  Before we do so, let me run down all of the mechanics of Cloud Nine so that we're on the same page. When a Pokemon with Cloud Nine is on the field... -Weather conditions stay active. -Other weather conditions can be placed or replaced, but do not give off effects. -Weather conditions have no effect.     - Fire and water moves do not get boosts.  - Desolate Land does not stop Water moves  - Primordial Sea does not stop Fire moves.  - Delta Stream does not weaken any moves   - Abilities like Swift Swim and Chlorophyll do not work. -Once the Pokemon with Cloud Nine leaves the field, the effects of weather immediately become active again, as long as the weather condition is still in play. Hopefully now you know everything there is to know about Cloud Nine.  Now let's evaluate each Pokemon...starting with Justin's favorite.   :D ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Golduck! Looking at Golduck's movepool, you'll see some very crazy things that it gets access to.  As fun as those options are... a lot of them aren't going to help you get far. Golduck's stats aren't spectacular by any means, so the new restricted Pokemon allowed this format will give it a tough time staying in for the long haul.  However, the job that it can do with this [somewhat] basic set is enough to often times trump 2 big threats: Primal-Groudon and Mega-Rayquaza. Golduck @ Focus Sash   Ability: Cloud Nine   Level: 50   EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe   Timid Nature   - Scald   - Ice Beam   - ????? - Protect Again, Golduck's stats aren't the greatest, so giving it a Focus Sash will give it a better chance at getting to do its job.  That means you can throw your EVs straight into the offense.  Unlike its defenses, its Special Attack, Physical Attack, and Speed are good enough to get it going in the right direction.  Cloud Nine means that Groudon and Rayquaza will be ever so vunerable to its STAB and always necessary ice-type coverage. 252+ Atk Adamant Primal Groudon Precipice Blades vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Golduck: 130-154 (83.8 - 99.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO AND 252 SpA Timid Golduck Scald vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Primal Groudon: 244-292 (138.6 - 165.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO For the Adamant variants of Groudon, it can outspeed and easily OHKO them, making any team's biggest threat, well, not so much of a threat.  Being able to crush the most powerful Pokemon in the format makes it worth considering, for sure.  But that's not its only use, of course. 252 SpA Golduck Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Rayquaza: 168-200 (93.3 - 111.1%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO HOWEVER... 252 SpA Golduck Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Rayquaza: 168-200 (93.3 - 111.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Life Orb damage AND 252 SpA Golduck Ice Beam vs. -1 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Rayquaza: 248-296 (137.7 - 164.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO, after the Defense and Special Defense drops of Dragon Ascent. It won't necessarily always win against Rayquaza, given that Golduck can get double targetted or have its Sash broken ahead of time, but it will certainly give the big bad dragon something to bite its nails about. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ There are a plethora of moves you can use in your fourth slot.  I said its movepool was extravagent, and I meant it.  Here are some noteworthy options, in no particular order: Icy Wind: Icy Wind is a great move to add to any team.  With enough power, it can 2HKO certain Pokemon that are quad weak, and it provides great speed control.  Hitting Rayquaza, Salamence, or Landorus with this can run them into a corner once they become ever so slower than your Pokemon. Clear Smog: This move has never been more useful.  It clears stat changes.  This move has "Cripple Xerneas" written all over it.  Granted the opposing Xerneas isn't too slow, you can use this right as they use Geomancy and make the Deer Lord seem like just a playground bully.  They won't be able to safely Geomancy again since their Power Herb will be gone. Encore: Encore is a solid support move to put on any Pokemon that your opponent would be unexpecting of.  Like Clear Smog, it can make Xerneas not much of a threat.  It can lock slower Pokemon into Protect, Fake Out, Trick Room, etc.  Not much else to say other than that it's always a great option to have. Role Play: This is a very crazy move to has, as it changes Golduck's main purpose.  Regaining any of the 3 Primal weather conditions by Role Play or Skill Swap immediately makes it take effect if a different one is in play. (I.E. If your oppenent has Primal-Groudon and Desolate Land on the field, and you use Role Play on your Mega-Rayquaza, Delta Stream will become active and Desolate Land will go away.)  You'll likely only want to Role Play the weather of your own Pokemon, as the opponent will try their hardest to have the weather their way.  However, making the right plays and knowing your win conditions, Role Play is quite the game changer in the right hands.  Of course, it can also copy Parental Bond... Worry Seed:  If you're so sick of game-determining abilities that you would rather that they just burn, Worry Seed completely removes them.  It gives the target a way less-threatening abiltiy: Insomnia.  Just don't use Amoonguss on your team.   Psych Up:  This move copies any stat changes of the Pokemon is targets.  More importantly, it will copy Xerneas's stat boosts! Your opponent will regret setting up if you pull this off.  This makes Golduck more than a Pokemon that counters just a few of the meta rulers. Disable:  Like Encore, this is a good move to have in any situation or team.  It stops that annoying move that your opponent loves to click to win.  Unless it's Kangaskhan.  Kangaskhan beats Sashed Golduck.   Screech: Not entirely useful, but considering Fake Tears is used and does well, I can see this being an option if the other moves mentioned here don't help you as much.  If Golduck can't pose enough of an offensive presence against the 2 Pokemon currently on the field, Screech can support your adjacent Physical attacker. Aqua Jet:  Like Shadow Sneak on Aegislash, it can pick up surprise KO's on weak Pokemon when you barely miss the mark. Simple Beam: Like Worry Seed, it changes the ability of the target.  Be careful, though.  The ability Simple doubles any stat changes the holder undergoes.  Make sure the opposing Groudon doesn't have Swords Dance, that Rayquaza doesn't have Dragon Dance, and that Kyogre doesn't have Calm Mind.  Using this over Worry Seed is a great choice if your Pokemon have stat changing moves, like the aforementioned Fake Tears, Calm Mind, or God-forbid Geomancy.  Oh gosh, that horrifies me... Soak: This move simply turns the target into a mono-water type.  Seems gimicky, but I do know of a Soak Basculin that did well at Worlds in VGC11, so its usefulness is not out of the question. Light Screen: Using screens on your team is up to the user to determine whether or not he or she wants to tank hits better in exchange for a turn and a move slot.  It's always hard to know when to use these... ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yep, Golduck's movepool is even more extravagent than that.  That's why I put question marks in that third slot.  It's all up to you!  Do some testing before you make that decision. In summary, if your team is struggling with other Groudons, Rayquazas, or Xerneass, and you don't have room for Kyogre, consider using Golduck! After all of that...we still have 2 more Pokemon to go through.  Bare with me...but the next Pokemon is one that I would consider to be even better and more fun to use than Golduck!  Fat Miley Cy-I mean Lickilicky!   :D ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Unlike Golduck, all of Lickilicky's stats are decent or better, except Speed.  However, until now, there was no clear purpose to using it.  But its bulk giving it great lasting power topped with Cloud Nine make it a massive support no matter how you use it.  Just don't us Explosion 24/7.   And also unlike Golduck, there are a number of great ways to use LickiLicky.  I do, however, have a resource to help us out. Competition evaluation: http://3ds.pokemon-gl.com/information/0c33c29e-815f-45f5-ab5e-043a51c86c9a Competition usage stats: http://3ds.pokemon-gl.com/competitions/4034/ In the first link, we have an evaluation of an online competition called the Primal Battle Competition.  This competition ran the same rules as VGC15, except for one change-the bans on Kyogre and Groudon were lifted, hence the name Primal Battle Competition.  On this evaluation, it goes over some of the successful and popular Pokemon that aren't seen as much in VGC15.  However, looking over the usage stats of all the Pokemon listed, (the second link,) I found something interesting.  I looked to see the strategies of Lickilicky, and saw that it had peculiar percentage numbers in usage.  Doing the math, I figured out why-a total of 7 Lickilickys were used.  I am not kidding on that one.  There are a number of moves and items used 14.3% of the time, which equals one seventh.  So out of the 7 that were used, it did well enough to get attention on the evaluation article.  That means something. Lickilicky serves more than a niche role.  It makes Kyogre win against Groudon very easily.  It has many support moves.  It tanks up so many attacks.  It puts in the work for your team...no matter how fat it may seem. kappa  We'll start with usable items: Assault Vest: A lot of Lickilicky's moves are attacks, supportive or good coverage.  Assualt Vest capitalizes on that and makes it even tougher to take down, Xerneas and Dialga be, er, danged.  BrokeBack  3 of the 7 in the PB competition used this item, for good reason. Leftovers: What easy option makes a bulky Pokemon even harder to take down?  Leftovers, of course!  This is similar to Assault Vest, as it can give your Lickilicky better staying power to make sure that your opponent doesn't get to use their weather for even more turns.  Leftovers will give you more things to work with than Assault Vest since you will still be able to use Status moves like Protect or Toxic.  1 of the 7 used this. Choice Specs: I put this in because I saw that one person in the PB competition used it.  And looking at Lickilicky through and through, it's not hard to see why.  Putting Choice Specs on an already unpredictable Pokemon makes it even less predictable, overwhelming your opponent with options.  Lickilicky has the bulk to withstand hits before it attacks, and its better than okay Special Attack as well as its very solid Special Attacking movepool make Choice Specs very effective!  But we'll get to those moves later. Choice Band: Works the same way as Choice Specs, since Lickilicky's offensive stats are the same.  You'll lose power for switching to the elemental punches over the beams, but Lickilicky's Physical movepool is deeper, giving you more to work with.  Choice Band Explosion is gonna hurt. Normal Gem: Don't like any of these items listed?  Just go with the good-old-fashioned Normal Gem Explosion gimmick!  Sure, Lickilicky's attack stat isn't up to par with Landorus or Kangaskhan, but that doesn't mean that its Explosion doesn't hit hard.  In fact, it hurts!  It hurts a lot!  And Lickilicky's attack isn't bad at all.  After all, it's the only Pokemon that gets a STAB'd Explosion.  375 power is already something to be scared of, and Normal Gem makes it that much more menacing, even if it's only a 1.3x boost this generation.  1 of the 7 used this item. Kee or Maranga Berry:  These items are another good means of staying in for the long haul.  Lickilicky doesn't have recovery moves like the better users of this item, (Milotic, Zapdos, Latias,) but I could see it working if your opponent doesn't know what to do against Lickilicky. Sitrus Berry: 1 of the 7 used this item.  For when you don't know what to put on a Pokemon, but you know that it can take one more hit if it has this.  Still, I think the first 4 items I mentioned are better options in general.  But if they don't fit, Sitrus Berry is always good to fall back on. There might only be some items that are useful, but the moves are a completely different story.  Lickilicky's movepool is even more useful than and as extravagent as Golduck's.  I'll split into 2 different sections.  The first will be very useful moves, while the second will be moves that aren't at all necessary, but can help your team if they're struggling with a certain problem. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Explosion: I don't think I need to talk about this one much more than I did when I talked about the Normal Gem.  When you feel that Lickilicky has served its purpose, your opponent doesn't want to target it, it needs to do something more, and you want a free and safe switch-in to your Pokemon in the back, go kamikaze and immediately put yourself in a better position.  That seems like a lot, but trust me, if you use Lickilicky like I do, you'll want to do this a lot.  Just don't forget that it affects your ally as well, so don't let it take the hit unless it absolutely can. Icy Wind: Refer to what I said about it above in the Golduck evaluation.  It won't hit as hard, but for Lickilicky being more of a support Pokemon than anything, Icy Wind is a very effective move on it. Power Whip: Yes, this thing gets Power Whip, and it is glorious.  It will do a sizable chunk to Kyogre, even if it's no Ferrothorn. Knock Off:  Again, more support than anything, but Knock Off is a great option on any decent or better Physical attacker. Ice Beam: Cloud Nine eliminates Ice's problem against Rayquaza, so Rayqauza is weaker to Lickilicky's Ice Beam than most Ice Beams, given that Delta Stream is up.  If you're using a full-on special attacking Lickilicky, this will deal with Ray-Ray very well. Flamethrower: Again, Lickilicky is amazing.  Good type coverage if your team is lacking it.  Nothing else I need to say. Disable:  Disable is Disable.  :P Dragon Tail: This move has negative priority and forces a switch on the target.  So what's the point of using it?  Actually, there's one huge use to it.  Since Trick Room has even less priority, Dragon Tail stops it!  If you're struggling against Trick Room, use this!  From personal experience, it's a great option.  2 battles in a row at a Premier Challenge (in VGC15 with a different Pokemon,) I was able to stop the opponent from getting in a dominating position by using this move on their Trick Room user. Muddy Water/Aqua Tail/Surf: One of the most important parts of Lickilicky.  This Pokemon is great on Kyogre teams as it can remove Groudon's win condition against its arch nemesis.  However, when you're missing the ruler of the Sea, Lickilicky can help avenge it.  Again, Cloud Nine means that Groudon will be affected regardless of Desolate Land.  Unfortunately, unlike Golduck, it cannot take out Groudon normally.  Muddy Water and Surf get cut power because they are spread moves, and Groudon's incredibly high Physical Defense prevents Aqua Tail from being a death sentence.  However, all of these options can easily 2HKO, so any water move on Lickilicky should be considered.  After all, isn't that why you want to use a Cloud Nine Pokemon? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Gyro Ball:  For when your Xerneas matchup isn't as good as you want it to be.  It won't KO, but it can take a lot off thanks to Lickilicky's respectable attack and low speed. Toxic: Like I said in Explosion, Lickilicky won't always be able to do much.  If you have more of a wally Lickilicky than anything, this is a respectable choice. Hammer Arm:  If you want to build your Lickilicky to hit hard, this is a move that I can see working well.  Fighting is always good coverage, and the speed drop helps its Trick Room matchup. Return: Again, when you want it to just be a good attacker, this is your main move. Rock Tomb: Another good support move.  Not as effective as Icy Wind, but if Ho-oh becomes big, this move will be good. Curse: Lickilicky's stellar bulk makes Curse a respectable choice, since it allows Lickilicky to hit incredibly hard outside of Explosion. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These are the moves I feel are worth explaining.  But just to give you an idea of Lickilicky's deep movepool, I'll list some other not-terrible options: Status moves: Belly Drum, Swords Dance, Substitute, Amnesia, Psych Up Other attacks: Thunderbolt, Rock Slide, Earthquake, Bulldoze, Fire Blast, Power-Up Punch, Belch, Ice Punch, Wring Out ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------                                                                                     Overall thoughts Lickilicky is so versatile that there is almost no wrong way to use it.  There is also no best way to use it.  Just use what looks good, test it, and see how it does.  Odds are, you won't be disappointed.  If you have Kyogre on your team and want to do better against Groudon, Lickilicky is your guy/gal!   I think that eventually I'll have some sets here, but for now I'll wait to see how Regionals next month go.  After all, I don't want to reveal my Lickilicky set that I am currently using.     The last Pokemon with Cloud Nine is honestly a lot more tricky for me to pan out.  However, with the help of a friend that is testing out Altaria this format, I feel more confident talking about it. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Altaria is tricky because it doesn't have the solid options that the other 2 Cloud Niners do.  It's just better off being the solid Mega that is is.  But like Rayquaza before it Megas, it can help you out in many ways. Altaria can easily one-shot Rayquaza with Draco Meteor or Hyper Voice, and has enough bulk to really tank Rayquaza and its Dragon Ascent.  And once it's Mega Altaria, Dragon moves mean nothing to it.  I think it will take people a while to start acknowledging Rayquaza's power, but eventually it will become a bigger threat that will make Altaria even better. When your opponent has Groudon, Altaria can stay in and tank fire moves while avoiding ground moves.  If the opposing Groudon only has those type of moves, Altaria will have no trouble staying in against it, even if Altaria can't necessarily deal much damage before it mega evolves.  This will help your water type get into the top position against Groudon, and it will let Kyogre do something if it can't get its Primordial Sea back up. If you have an Altaria on your team, I would recommend having its Mega Evolution as an option.  It should be your second choice to mega evolve, and you should have another Mega Evolution on your team that you use more or as often as Altaria.  It won't be great in some matchups, but it will serve a great purpose in others. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Now on to the ways to use Altaria.  Sadly, I never got to use Altaria last season even though I wanted to, but I'll do my best to show its strong points.  I won't have EV spreads on any of these movesets since I haven't tested these out, but based on things I've talked about to friends, these movesets seem to do the trick for the most part. Altaria-Mega @ Altarianite   Ability: Cloud Nine   Level: 50   - Hyper Voice   - Flamethrower/Heat Wave/Fire Blast/Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse - Tailwind   - Roost This set is designed to let Altaria have uses both inside and outside of Mega evolution.  Tailwind will support your teammates plenty, while Roost can let it stay in for as long as it needs to to keep Cloud Nine on the field.  Hyper Voice because it's Pixilate, and the 4th move can be used for whatever coverage you prefer to have.  Looking at the PB competition results for Altaria, apparently Fire Blast was the most common choice of the 3 fire type moves that it could learn, and Flamethrower wasn't used enough to be listed.  Not sure I follow, but any of those are solid choices as Fire-type moves are always good coverage, especially when you decide to let Desolate Land stay up.  Othewise, Dragon Pulse deals decent neutral damage, and Draco Meteor is a last resort effort to take something down. Altaria-Mega @ Altarianite   Ability: Cloud Nine   Level: 50   - Return   - Earthquake/Roost - Dragon Dance   - Protect Despite its offensive stats, Altaria can still pose a threat when a Dragon Dance is set up on top of its already great natural bulk and typing.  Return boosted by Pixilate does a lot, just like a Salamence Return would do.  And like Salamence, you can use Roost to keep yourself in for some action.  Otherwise, Earthquake is a great option for coverage if you don't want to only have one attack.  It helps with Groudon and Dialga. Here are some other noteworthy moves that you can give it: FeatherDance:  This move heavily cripples your opponent when you want Altaria to be more of a support Pokemon.  Charm is used, and this move is the same thing. Cotton Guard:  This move raises defense by 3.  Any Pokemon that uses this move immediately becomes much harder to take down.  With Altaria's great defense, it's even better than it normally is on other Pokemon. Power Swap: It's weird to look at this move.  Power Swap is something that's never seen, but looking at Altaria's stats in comparison to monsters like the Hoenn trio, it's hard to see why this move isn't good. The moment I see it used well, I will be immediately be sold on using it.  Until then...it's only good in theory.  But I don't see it being bad at all. Summary Altaria is not always going to have a good matchup, but if you can find a good contrasting Mega to pair it up with, it can prove itself to be very useful in stopping your opponents' Primals.  I can't disrecommend this Pokemon in the slightest. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Since we're on the subject of weather stoppers, I think there's one more thing I should mention.  There is an ability that existed before Cloud Nine that does the same thing. It's called Air Lock.  Sound familiar?  It should if you've seen Rayquaza on the field before. Of course, once Rayquaza mega evolves, it puts up its own extreme weather condition, which trumps Desolate Land and Primordial Sea.  However, when playing with or against Rayquaza, it is important to know your win conditions if they involve turning the tide of battle with weather conditions.  If your opponent has Kyogre and Rayquaza on their team, for example, and you have Groudon, they can just simply switch in Rayquaza so that Kyogre can OHKO your Groudon.  You might not think of it because Rayquaza needs to Mega-evolve to get Delta Stream up, but in reality they don't need to do that if they keep normal Rayquaza in.  This is especially useful if Rayquaza's opponent tries to Skill Swap or Role Play to re-activate Desolate Land after Rayquaza Mega-evolves.  It's not the biggest game changer, since you'll want to have Rayquaza Mega almost all of the time, but it's something to consider.  He's not just threatening as a Mega. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Well, I think I covered a good amount.  I spent hours typing this up and evaluating everything, so I hope this helped some of you out with your team building.  I hope to expand on this article later with more builds and calculations when I have more experience with these Pokemon, a.k.a. when I have more time.  :P  And I'll try fix some of the clutter as well.  For now, I need to sleep knowing that I just wrote a 3-page essay on something that I love.   Thanks for reading, and remember to have fun! RE: "I'm on Cloud Nine like a-Golduck?" Shedding light on a very useful VGC16 ability. - Orodreth - Jan 20, 2016 Great Topic @MagnusHexem ! It is kinda hard to make them work, but they certainly have a place in the meta and can do great as switch-in to make attacks work. I have seen some interesting strategies, specially on Lickylicky that I want to try out but all these are great options. I would say they work best sided with Kyogre and against Groudon teams, as they totally destroy it's ability to stop the Kyogre sweep. RE: "I'm on Cloud Nine like a-Golduck?" Shedding light on a very useful VGC16 ability. - Marcusube - Jan 20, 2016 Great analysis Magnus! To be honest, I only see Lickilicky being a consistent option in this format and Explosion Lickilicky isn't to be underestimated. 252+ Atk Normal Gem Lickilicky Explosion vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Xerneas: 178-211 (88.5 - 104.9%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO Okay okay, I'll admit that's a pretty farfetch'd calc because no one would run 252 EVs with an offensive nature on Lickilicky but I do feel that Helping Hand Explosion would be a strong lead option especially if the Helping Hand user resists Explosion or is immune (btw, no Ghost type gets Helping Hand sadly). Altaria is way better off in its Mega Forme and can't do much in this meta in its normal form other than take Eruptions and Water Spouts really well and do chip damage with Draco Meteor or Dragon Pulse. Cloud Nine Fire Blast Altaria can be good for Ferrothorns and Scizors but that's really it for coverage. Golduck is really more of a gimmick this format because it is slower than what it needs to hit and is frail. All the opponent needs to do is double target it for the kill. I have seen a strategy with Soak Golduck and Bolt Strike Zekrom work though (which is one of the reasons why I think its gimmicky) Overall, combating this meta with Cloud Nine is a decent option but it's more effective to just take out the Primals with their respective weaknesses. Cloud Nine is more of a reactive than proactive solution to the issue of weather and playing reactive is what makes the metagame boring for players RE: "I'm on Cloud Nine like a-Golduck?" Shedding light on a very useful VGC16 ability. - Swimmingpenguin791 - Jan 20, 2016 Nice thread RE: "I'm on Cloud Nine like a-Golduck?" Shedding light on a very useful VGC16 ability. - jouzea - Jan 20, 2016 Nice write up. So that's why my Pdon fainted against the blue duck. It was fast and just scalded my Pdon. RE: "I'm on Cloud Nine like a-Golduck?" Shedding light on a very useful VGC16 ability. - MagnusHexem - Jan 28, 2016 I'm going to edit in some things in that I forgot, (like Soak Golduck,) fix a few typos, and adjust some things based on what the Special Battle Season stats on the Global Link have shown. I think this thread is worth keeping around if you hate the Primals. Golduck is sort of a gimmick in a way, but not like other gimmicks that take setting up. It does counter Groudon and sometimes Rayquaza, and when put in the right hands, it can put your opponent in a bad position if they rely on the meta too much. It can be easily stopped if your opponent knows what they're doing, but I think it's still decent or better. However, I have to agree with you that Lickilicky is the best of the 3, if it wasn't clear by my analysis. I did, however, kind of forget that they nerfed Gems' power from 2x down to 1.3x, despite them taking out the other Gems completely. Still, someone did use Normal Gem, so maybe it's better than I thought? *looks at Global Link stats* Okay, I am not impressed by these Lickilicky stats. They were a little better a few days ago, but people aren't using the greatest stuff on them. Protect is the 2nd most used move, really? Anything that doesn't have Assault Vest has it? Fire Blast used more than Flamethrower? If Flamethrower doesn't kill Ferrothorn, than I guess I can see why. And what's this? Wise Glasses?? Who's idea was that?? And where's Explosion's usage? Maybe using Lickilicky is harder to use than I thought it was... Hopefully the International Challenge will shed some light on Lickilicky.