[RATE MY TEAM] Mega Metagross VGC Team

[DanielJames]

I know that there are some knowledgable people on here when it comes to VGC so I need your help. The past couple teams I've built have performed rather poorly which is frustrating. Take a look at my current team and let me know what changes you would make. EV spreads/movesets/items/Pokémon/natures. Pick everything apart and let me know what would work better, if anything.

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
Level: 50
EVs: 220 HP / 52 Atk / 20 Def / 36 SpD / 180 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Protect
- Substitute
- Iron Head
- Zen Headbutt

This build was found on these forums. I liked the idea of running Substitute, mainly to avoid Sucker Punch from Bisharp, which completely wrecks Metagross. It also shields it from other super effective attacks so it can launch off powerful Iron Heads and Zen Headbutts, thanks to it’s Tough Claws ability. The one downside to this build is its lack of move coverage. Hammer Arm or another coverage move would be nice to run, but just doesn’t fit on this set unfortunately. When are they going to let us run five moves?

Hydreigon (M) @ Chople Berry
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Draco Meteor
- Earth Power
- Flamethrower

Hydreigon has great synergy with Metagross, being able to handle Dark-type attacks aimed at it while being able to hit many Pokémon super-effectively thanks to it’s diverse move pool. Earth Power deals with Heatran, which KOs Metagross. Draco Meteor destroys Dragon-types and hits everything else, besides Fairy-types, incredibly hard. Flamethrower is used for Steel- and Grass-types and Dark Pulse for a STAB move that hits Cresselia, Aegislash, and Gengar hard.

Togekiss (M) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Super Luck
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 192 Def / 44 SpD / 20 Spe
Calm Nature
- Tailwind
- Follow Me
- Roost
- Dazzling Gleam

Togekiss provides Follow Me support, allowing Metagross to use Substitute. Togekiss also provides Tailwind support, which is essential because I run a Modest Hydreigon and an Adamant Metagross so they hit harder. Togekiss takes a lot of hits so Roost is essential in keeping it on the field longer. I went with Dazzling Gleam for spread damage, plus it hits for a decent amount, sometimes knocking out weakened Pokémon.

Terrakion @ Focus Sash
Ability: Justified
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Protect
- Quick Guard
- Rock Slide
- Close Combat

I was originally using Virizion just to use something different than the standard Terrakion that I use on a lot of my teams, but found out quickly that Charizard and Heatran not only gave Metagross problems, but Virizion as well. Terrakion was the prefect answer, being able to deal with both problems by launching off STAB Rock Slide and Close Combats. Quick Guard is nice against Prankster users as well, which can be annoying to deal with.

Milotic (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Competitive
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 28 Def / 160 SpA / 64 SpD / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
- Protect
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Recover

Looking at my team, I needed a bulky Water-type Pokémon that could deal with Landorus. Plus, it’s ability makes opponents think twice before leading with an Intimidate user. Milotic is hard to take down and after a Competitive boost; it deals a lot of damage. Scald is one of the best moves in the game and Recover lets it stay on the field longer.

Thundurus @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 192 HP / 76 SpA / 220 SpD / 20 Spe
Calm Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Thunderbolt
- Taunt
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Pretty standard Thundurus. I needed a Taunt user to stop those TR teams and Thundurus hits Charizard for decent damage and can deal damage to Landorus and Dragon-types with HP Ice. Thunder Wave is also another great way to get some speed control so my heavy hitters attack first.

[DanielJames]

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle...-259849322

Here's a wild win I just pulled off on Showdown. Metagross was burned and at 1%.

[Delta]

There are a few points I have with this team.

No. 1:
You didn't explain why you use the EV's you do. I really want to know why you use the EV spread on Metagross, and the EV spread on Milotic.

No. 2:
I have used Mega Metagross more than any other pokemon, but I don't normally run any specific EV's other than Max Attack and Speed or Max Health and Attack. Either way, I have never used Substitute, ever. I always run Bullet Punch, Meteor Mash, Protect, and Zen Headbutt on my Metagross, and I leave Heatran to be taken care of by my other teammates. I understand the appeal of Hammer Arm, but I have never needed it, because I use the rest of my team to kill whatever Metagross can't. I use Bullet Punch because it can catch people by surprise, and is an amazing Priority attack to finish of those pesky Focus Sash Bisharp.

No. 3:
I like Hydreigon. He is super cool, and hits pretty hard. If I were you, I would put a Life Orb (or even Choice Specs) on Hydreiegon, and swap out Flamethrower for Protect (unless you want Choice Specs). You will need the Tailwind to truly wreak havoc, but Hydreigon is often bulky enough to take a hit. I honestly wouldn't use Chople Berry because the aforementioned items will make Hydreigon a true terror (and fighting type attacks aren't extremely common). If you run Choice Specs, you will be able to OHKO a non bulky Kangaskhan most of the time.

No. 4:
If you could please elaborate on the EV's, that would be great. Also, I would run Sitrius Berry over Safety Goggles, but it is more of a personal preference. The moveset looks good.

No. 5:
Everything looks good here. Nothing needs to change.

No. 6:
I hate to repeat myself, but, ELABORATE ON THE EV's! I need to know why you chose that specific set (so I might steal it one day). Anyways, that aside, I have my own specific EV's for a Milotic.

Milotic @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Competitive
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 156 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Protect
- Recover

This set survives an Adamant, 252 Aerialate Double Edge from a Mega Salamence, and will always survive a Jolly Mega Kang Double Edge. I run Rocky Helmet because I want Kangaskhan to go die in a ditch when it uses Double Edge.

No. 7:
blah blah blah EV's blah blah blah. I wouldn't change it otherwise.


There are a few things that can cause you problems. Aegislash does amazing against your team. The only thing you have to counter Aegislash is Hydreigon, and if it dies, you are going to have a hard time killing it, especially the super annoying Substitute Aegislashs'. Trick Room could be a problem, especially with Aromatisse, because it can't be Taunted, and super physically bulky ones can survive an Iron Head. Your team does not have much to counter opposing Thundurus' other than Terrakion. I would also like to battle your Metagross team with my Metagross team.

[DanielJames]

The Metagross EV spread was taken from Black117. The EV spread is meant to do the following (copy and pasted from his thread):

-Outspeed neutral base 100 Pokemon like Mega Kangaskhan
-Outspeed positive base 85 and 86 Pokemon like Suicune, Heracross, Rotom-A
-Takes one unboosted Shadow Ball from positive special attack Aegislash
-Takes one Life Orb Sucker Punch from Adamant Bisharp

For Togekiss, here are the reasons for the EV spread (taken from Positron38):

Damage Calculations: Defensive

252+ Atk Landorus-T Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 192 Def Togekiss: 250-296 (66.8 - 79.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (You don't really need the defense investment because at 0 or 252 Def, it will most likely be just a 2HKO from Landorus-T, unless it's a crit. I just put it there to survive a crit from Rock Slide Tongue.)
252+ Atk Landorus-T Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Togekiss: 272-320 (72.7 - 85.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Landorus-T Rock Slide vs. 252 HP / 192 Def Togekiss on a critical hit: 282-332 (75.4 - 88.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 192 Def Togekiss: 312-369 (83.4 - 98.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Yes, if you're up against a life orb 252 atk Bisharp, it will take 2 hits to KO. That's pretty kewl
252+ SpA Aegislash-Shield Flash Cannon vs. 252 HP / 44+ SpD Togekiss: 32-42 (8.5 - 11.2%) -- possible 9HKO (This is amazing. Even at 44 SpD ivenstment, it will still take at least 9 hits of Flash Cannon for it to KO Togekiss.)
252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 192 Def Togekiss: 262-309 (70 - 82.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Damage Caculations: Offensive

0 SpA Togekiss Dazzling Gleam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Salamence: 228-270 (68.6 - 81.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 SpA Togekiss Dazzling Gleam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Bisharp: 139-165 (51.1 - 60.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

As for the Milotic, here's the EV spread reasons (posted by Eeveeli):

Offensive Caluclations
Without Competitive boost
160+ SpA Milotic Ice Beam vs. 248 HP / 56 SpD Salamence-Mega: 180-216 (89.5 - 107.4%)
160+ SpA Milotic Ice Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Choice Scarf Landorus-Therian: 208-248 (126 - 150.3%)
160+ SpA Milotic Scald vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 156-186 (101.2 - 120.7%)
160+ SpA Milotic Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Garchomp-Mega: 204-244 (111.4 - 133.3%)

With Competitive boost
+2 160+ SpA Milotic Ice Beam vs. 248 HP / 56 SpD Salamence-Mega: 360-424 (179.1 - 210.9%)
+2 160+ SpA Milotic Scald vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Bisharp: 154-183 (109.2 - 129.7%)
+2 160+ SpA Milotic Ice Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Thundurus: 208-246 (134.1 - 158.7%)
+2 160+ SpA Milotic Scald vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Terrakion: 282-332 (169.8 - 200%)

Defensive Calculations
252+ Atk Aerilate Salamence-Mega Return (Flying) vs. 252 HP / 28 Def Milotic: 157-186 (77.7 - 92%)
252 SpA Life Orb Thundurus Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 64 SpD Assault Vest Milotic: 104-125 (51.4 - 61.8%)
252 SpA Manectric-Mega Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 64 SpD Assault Vest Milotic: 84-102 (41.5 - 50.4%)
252 Atk Parental Bond Kangaskhan-Mega Return vs. 252 HP / 28 Def Milotic: 150-177 (74.2 - 87.6%)
252 SpA Rotom-Wash Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 64 SpD Assault Vest Milotic: 72-86 (35.6 - 42.5%)

I agree with your points about the Hydreigon. I'll make the necessary changes! And I'm totally down to battle sometime.

[Delta]

Those are some pretty nice damage calculations. There are just a few things it looks like you overlooked.

A. Milotic does not have an Assault Vest, but that was probably just a mistake.

B. The Aegislash calcs on Togekiss is from shield form. You will never get hit by shied form.

I doubt many Salamence's actually run Return in VGC. They pretty much all use Double Edge, but they will rarely be Adamant, so you will (probably) be safe. You also didn't include the Thundurus EV spread at the time I am writing this.

[DanielJames]

Ah, you're right. A few overlooked calculations but overall the EV spreads hold up. I did try a max Attack and Speed invested Metagross and it definitely makes a difference in terms of it's damage output. It was also able to still take hit pretty well. Bullet Punch came in handy a few times too, letting me sneak out a win in one game. Life Orb Hydreigon also performed well but I already knew it would. I'm trying out your Milotic build but I haven't brought her into any battles yet on Showdown.

As for the EV spread on Thundurus, I got it awhile ago from Rouge on the "Pokemon VGC 2015 Metagame Megathread" on here. The build has always worked well for me so I've never changed it. It doesn't give me calcs for the spread, but it does say this:

"I wanted to start off with one of the most effective sets. Most players run special defense over defense for many reasons. One reason is because rock slide is very common. You'd have to run FULL HP and Defensive investment to not get OHKO'd by strong rock slide users like Tyranitar. (and thats assuming you also have 31 defense IV's.) You can also live Draco Meteor's from things like Timid Latios.
Back to the set: This set is good for many reasons. You can speed creep taunt those other Thundurus users with 16 speed. You can taunt those who like to set up trick room, and ruin them. You can thunder-wave all the things. You can deal some good damage with thunderbolt. and finally, the hidden power is up to you. Ice for ground types (and dragons) and flying for that STAB hit. Sitrus Berry for that recovery to continue to annoy your opponent. Don't sleep on this set. Trust me."