[RATE MY TEAM] Stall n Brawl! VGC stall/sweep team must see!

[Pokeventurer]

Hi guys back with another RMT post, this time a built a team around a new style never seen before in VGC. as the title suggests the team was focused on being a balance of stall and offensive pressure. the following is how the idea came to me:

Derivation of idea:
so yesterday i was having a look at my TCG collection (idk the competitive strats really though) i though it would be a really cool deck if someone baited out many pokemon basic, while getting their hand full of really good cards from the deck and then wreck through their opponents. the same idea came to me when i thought i wanted to build a new team, i knew toxic stall could be applied to VGC too with powerful sweepers in the back to pick off the weakened ones from the field. and here comes the team:

The Team:


Mawile @ Mawilite
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 80 HP / 252 Atk / 12 Def / 32 SpD / 132 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Play Rough
- Iron Head
- Super Fang
- Protect

I used the same mawile that i used for a past team of mine, this one basically outspeeds mega-mence after tailwind by one point. play rough is simple but as the team was completed sucker punch was replaced by iron head to solely counter the threat of specs sylveon and check it before it wrecks me. super fang is a thread to the stall part of the team as it makes it's own job way easier and helps compliment other stall moves. i choose this guy as the mega as it was the idea of a strong pokemon that i love sweeping with, intimidate comes in handy regarding defensive purposes.


Noivern Editz: @ Life Orb / Focus sash need suggestions
Ability: Telepathy
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Super Fang
- Protect
- Tailwind

i was looking up for synergetic pokemon with mawile, noivern was the best one i found it has a great switch-in synergy + it sets up tailwinds for mawile's purposes, over all for the team tailwind was crucial. draco meteor helps pick up many mons while super fang turns out great in many battles and adds to the team archetype (stall). Noivern has great supportive importance with tailwind being an important slot. it won't be really ever taunted as people expect the team to be quite different and they expect thundurus is the support mon.


Ludicolo @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Swift Swim
Level: 50
EVs: 132 HP / 4 Def / 116 SpA / 28 SpD / 228 Spe
Modest Nature
- Fake Out
- Giga Drain
- Surf
- Teeter Dance

i built an extremely bad team that did had a ludicolo like this on it for the same purpose ,the team was scrapped but it came back with the telepathy noivern, unfortunately it is still effected by teeter dance but that is worth it. fake out is good to waste/block opponents turns especially when trying to stall, sitrus berry keeps it out longer on the field. giga drain further recovers it, surf recovers and helps vaporeon stall longer,whereas teeter dance while adding to the stall is the reason of extreme annoyance.


Vaporeon @ Leftovers Editz: nope definitely using Rocky Helmet #MoreAnnoyingStall
Ability: Water Absorb
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 144 SpA
Modest Nature
- Scald
- Protect
- Wish
- Toxic

idk why i added the EV's this way, someone plz suggest a better spread, you already know it's function and job, in addition it helps to recover further back with wish and toxic stalls out really well, leftovers adds to the bulk, i wanna replace this for rocky helmet as it would help increase chip damage on my opponents. the tru idea of weakening mons_ vaporeon shenanigans.


Tyranitar @ Lum Berry
Ability: Sand Stream
Level: 50
EVs: 148 HP / 172 Atk / 4 Def / 124 SpD / 60 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Slide
- Protect
- Crunch
- Superpower

I did thought of the idea of using a hazardous weather for the team, right from the start, after testing aboma and hippowdon tyranitar was my final option that also helped me counter steel types with superpower and aegislash in particular with crunch (who toxic can't touch). as my team with safety goggles and steel types can't be touched by sandstorm. tyranitar shines in most games it's speed EV investments allow it to outspeed terrakion after tailwind and then bash with a superpower (if non sashed). lum berry negates teeter dance for once and other status shenanigans too.


Thundurus (M) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Rain Dance
- Toxic
- Taunt
- Thunderbolt

This is quite an interesting and different thundurus, but however it fits right in to the team, wanna know why? i did wanted anther toxic setter and taunt from destroying my strategy, so i wanted a a faster taunt than most and toxic quickly off the field too. so i went for the offensive build even after stalling a little it can pick up mons easily with thunderbolts, as timid nature, at max speed ties with mirror-matches and gives me a good chance. i needed a second weather support as ludi+vaporoen was quite bland and it worked out well for m-mawile's defenses too (rain dance). Safety goggles over any others to have a lead/pair counter against amoongus, especially on a stall team.

Battle vids:

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle...-256177737

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle...-256178963

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle...-256181563

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle...-256183344

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle...-256184414

Editz: sry delta pointed out flaws in the post i felt it was important to post these here:
Important points on the team members accordingly:
1) Super fang pays off ultimately adding to partner pokemon KO'ing the one being targeted by it.
2) Same thing the team was part stall and i never felt need of anything but this move. telepathy was the idea that ludicolo with surf came back giving it two immunities to hit opposing pokemons.
3) Ludi +vaporeon with a rain dance set up by thundurus was both ultimate stall, hax and pretty much the muscle of the team. love em both!
4) "3)"
5) As i mentioned directly in the title and in t-tar's description, a stall team, sandstorm comes in handy wearing off annoying amoongus'
6) i know that people will think that the thundurus is a joke, but in reality it just adds more and more potential to the whole of the team, and this one was team specific (warning don't try this at home, school or anywhere).

Conclusion:
Hope you guys enjoyed the crafty idea for the team and i know this can still be much more improvised by your suggestions, so don't forget to rate and maybe even leave a rep..... if u liked the idea. Bye for now! *Phew this wasn't that bad of a team than the no attack one*

[Delta]

Okay. I love the idea of Noivern and Mega Mawile. I think that is pretty smart. Other than that, I pretty much hate the rest of your team.

1. Do not run Super Fang on a Mega Mawile. Run Crunch. Otherwise, you are completely walled out by Aegislash. I do like the Tailwind idea though, very creative.

2. Don't run Super Fang on Noivern. I have used Super Fang before and I do not like it. It just sits there, not being used. Another move would be much better. Let me recommend: Boomburst, Hurricane, Flamethrower, Dark Pulse, Boomburst, Boomburst, Boomburst. Did I mention Boomburst? Because if I didn't, Boomburst. Also, run Frisk over Telepathy. There is noone on your team that would hit Noivern, and frisk can be so useful.

3. Ludicolo is a bad pokemon outside of rain. This doesn't strike me as a rain team, so get rid of Ludicolo. If you want a powerful grass type pokemon (and who doesn't?) then go with Contrary Serperior. He can get Taunt, Glare, Mirror Coat, and, of course, the broken Leaf Storm. I would recommend running a Focus Sash with him, and also have Mirror Coat. That way, you can OHKO Sylveon after it hits you with Hyper Voice.

4. Do you like Vaporeon? Then keep it. Otherwiese, get rid of it. I would switch the Defense EV's with the Special Attack EV's , and then move those Special Attack EV's into Special Defense. If you don't really like Vaporeon, then switch it out for Gastrodon, Cradily, or Milotic.

5. I have used Tyranitar many times in doubles. I am not a huge fan of it, especially with Focus Sash Serperior. If you want a pokemon that can counter Steels and Aegislash, as well as flying pokemon, then look no further than Mammoswine. He gets: Superpower, Earthquake, Rock Slide, Icicle Crash, Ice Shard. All of those are very good coverage moves. He also gets Thick Fat, which means his fire Weakness doesn't matter all that much.

6. I don't like your Thundurus, but I honestly think that Thundurus is the right pokemon for the job right now. Just not that Thundurus. I honestly can't recommend a certain set or EV's because I myself am searching for that right combination. You need Taunt, and Thunder Wave, and after that, it is up to you.

Those are my 2 cents. Overall, I don't like Tailwind teams, because after those 4 turns are up, it is hard to regain momentum.

[Pokeventurer]

(Aug 5, 2015, 07:45 AM)Delta Wrote: Okay. I love the idea of Noivern and Mega Mawile. I think that is pretty smart. Other than that, I pretty much hate the rest of your team.

1. Do not run Super Fang on a Mega Mawile. Run Crunch. Otherwise, you are completely walled out by Aegislash. I do like the Tailwind idea though, very creative.

2. Don't run Super Fang on Noivern. I have used Super Fang before and I do not like it. It just sits there, not being used. Another move would be much better. Let me recommend: Boomburst, Hurricane, Flamethrower, Dark Pulse, Boomburst, Boomburst, Boomburst. Did I mention Boomburst? Because if I didn't, Boomburst. Also, run Frisk over Telepathy. There is noone on your team that would hit Noivern, and frisk can be so useful.

3. Ludicolo is a bad pokemon outside of rain. This doesn't strike me as a rain team, so get rid of Ludicolo. If you want a powerful grass type pokemon (and who doesn't?) then go with Contrary Serperior. He can get Taunt, Glare, Mirror Coat, and, of course, the broken Leaf Storm. I would recommend running a Focus Sash with him, and also have Mirror Coat. That way, you can OHKO Sylveon after it hits you with Hyper Voice.

4. Do you like Vaporeon? Then keep it. Otherwiese, get rid of it. I would switch the Defense EV's with the Special Attack EV's , and then move those Special Attack EV's into Special Defense. If you don't really like Vaporeon, then switch it out for Gastrodon, Cradily, or Milotic.

5. I have used Tyranitar many times in doubles. I am not a huge fan of it, especially with Focus Sash Serperior. If you want a pokemon that can counter Steels and Aegislash, as well as flying pokemon, then look no further than Mammoswine. He gets: Superpower, Earthquake, Rock Slide, Icicle Crash, Ice Shard. All of those are very good coverage moves. He also gets Thick Fat, which means his fire Weakness doesn't matter all that much.

6. I don't like your Thundurus, but I honestly think that Thundurus is the right pokemon for the job right now. Just not that Thundurus. I honestly can't recommend a certain set or EV's because I myself am searching for that right combination. You need Taunt, and Thunder Wave, and after that, it is up to you.

Those are my 2 cents. Overall, I don't like Tailwind teams, because after those 4 turns are up, it is hard to regain momentum.

Did u read all of the post?
1) super fang pays off ultimately adding to partner pokemon KO'ing the one being targeted by it. (i'll keep credits for the tailwind)
2) same thing the team was part stall and i never felt need of anything but this move. telepathy was the idea that ludicolo with surf came back giving it two immunities to hit opposing pokemons.
3) ludi +vaporeon with a rain dance set up by thundurus was both ultimate stall, hax and pretty much the muscle of the team. i ain't gonna replace em love em both!
4) "3)"
5) As i mentioned directly in the title and in t-tar's description, a stall team, sandstorm comes in handy wearing off annoying amoongus'
6) i know that people will think that the thundurus is a joke, but in reality it just adds more and more potential to the whole of the team, and this one was team specific (warning don't try this at home, school or anywhere).

i do respect your opinion and sorry if this feels disrespectful in any manner, cuz i feel that everyone's comfort-ability and playstyle varies alot while rating teams, sry if i wasn't clear enough. Thnx alot for taking the time to write a detailed reply

[Delta]

(Aug 5, 2015, 09:15 AM)Pokeventurer Wrote: Did u read all of the post?
1) super fang pays off ultimately adding to partner pokemon KO'ing the one being targeted by it. (i'll keep credits for the tailwind)
2) same thing the team was part stall and i never felt need of anything but this move. telepathy was the idea that ludicolo with surf came back giving it two immunities to hit opposing pokemons.
3) ludi +vaporeon with a rain dance set up by thundurus was both ultimate stall, hax and pretty much the muscle of the team. i ain't gonna replace em love em both!
4) "3)"
5) As i mentioned directly in the title and in t-tar's description, a stall team, sandstorm comes in handy wearing off annoying amoongus'
6) i know that people will think that the thundurus is a joke, but in reality it just adds more and more potential to the whole of the team, and this one was team specific (warning don't try this at home, school or anywhere).

i do respect your opinion and sorry if this feels disrespectful in any manner, cuz i feel that everyone's comfort-ability and playstyle varies alot while rating teams, sry if i wasn't clear enough. Thnx alot for taking the time to write a detailed reply

I completely understand your position here. It isn't what I would run, but I have to remember, it isn't about me. It is about you. I play very differently (I don't do much in the way of strategy, I just break down the enemy team with Metagross), and so I put my playstyle into my reviews/criticisms. One of these days, I would love to fight you.

EDIT:
I just realized that I didn't watch the replay videos. My bad.

EDIT2:
Something I find super funny, I battled the person from the second battle video. I would say lol, but I hate lol, so I won't. Even though I just said it twice.

[Marcusube]

Here you have a Mawile EV'd to outspeed Mence by 1 point under Tailwind. If your Tailwind setter can OHKO Mence, why EV it to achieve such a goal?

A combination of Super Fang + Sucker Punch makes more sense seeing as how you can chip the opponent down to a range in which they will be OHKOd without having to risk getting outsped the following turn.

252+ Atk Huge Power Mega Mawile Play Rough vs. 188 HP / 68 Def Sylveon: 186-219 (95.8 - 112.8%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

Play Rough already has a good enough chance to OHKO Sylveon so your reason for running Iron Head is a bit redundant.

The problem I see with Noivern is that it gets walled clean by Fairy types, doesn't have enough offensive or supportive impact on the field and is an easy picking for any mon that outspeeds. You know, Landorus, Terrakion, Ludicolo, Kingdra, Thundurus-T scarfed etc. In my opinion, for this role, Crobat would be more effective. It has more bulk, Inner Focus allows it to always get up Tailwind first turn and it has a better defensive typing than Noivern. The only issue would be the loss of Telepathy and Dragon coverage but even then, Noivern couldn't get much work in before getting bodied.

Relying on RNG.....hiss

Anyways, Ludicolo works well without the rain, however, it isn't a mon that works well under stall conditions. What I mean is, this little mexican duck gets destroyed by strong physical attackers and sometimes even special attackers.

A Smogon stall set in VGC.... Sigh

I wouldn't recommend running heavy stall in VGC especially if you plan to go up against experienced players. I'm going to be honest here. Vaporeon is a good mon and has potential for VGC, but this just isn't the way. With the abundance of strong electric types and bulky grass types in VGC, you know, Thundurus, Amoonguss, Ferrothorn, Raichu, Zapdos, Venusaur, Rotom and so forth, Vaporeon gets shat on easily. Not to mention this mon isn't tanking Hyper Voices from Sylveon and Gardevoir and Double Edges from Kangaskhan and Salamence anytime soon. With it being pressured by so much in the meta, why run it.

I'd say scrap Ludicolo and Vaporeon and go for a basic Politoed + Kingdra core. Use combinations such as Encore + Disable, Helping Hand + Muddy Water/Surf and really drive some offense into it. You can stall all you want with Toxic if you please, the point is this attacking mode easily deals with common threats to stall if played properly

You have Rain already, why is Tyranitar here. Tyranitar is a very strong mon in VGC. I say this from my experience using and facing it. The problem is, it doesn't synergize with this team. If you need to counter Steel types, bring Pokemon with Ground, Fighting or Fire moves. Steel types kill Rock types and with Tyranitar you put yourself in 50/50 situations especially with Aegislash.

Thundurus ey? To be honest, Thundurus only stays on the field for so long in most matches because of Sitrus Berry. Outside of that, this mon is an easy 2HKO. Off the bat, anything that threatens Thundurus and can creep past Mawile and Ludicolo can crush the offensive core of this team and force you to use stall. Amoonguss and Ferrothorn come to mind here. Sure you can taunt Amoonguss but that buys the opponent time to deal with Thundurus. I still don't get why Rain Dance is on this set. Other than boosting Ludicolo's speed and the damage of Surf and Scald and disrupting opposing weather teams, what really is it doing?

I'm going to be honest again. I can't comprehend this team and how it functions, nor can I see it getting far on the ladder or in a Premier Challenge or Tournament. This team is too gimmicky and each gimmick looks like it complements each team member but it kinda works like this. It helps 2 mons on the team and hinders the rest from fully functioning. Not saying bad team but I would have to see more of it before I can even make a proper analysis on it