[RATE MY TEAM] Revised team

[MDofTheK]

Behold, the result of a nights worth of planning and calculating


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Celesteela @ Leftovers
Ability: Beast Boost
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 100 Def / 164 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Flamethrower
- Heavy Slam

My wonderwall, Celesteela is a very tanky member of my team, it's Leech Seed+Leftover+Protect Stalling has won me some tight wins, it's one of my teams only answers to Porygon2, Mudsdale and Alola Ninetales, the former two especially since they require immense stalling and wittling down
Flamethrower is for Kartana, Celesteela is my only answer to switch into Leaf Blades and annihilate with Flamethrower, Heavy Slam is for STAB and despite not investment hits decently, not like Celesteela is used for power but for stall.
It struggles with Arcanine as expected.

The EVs focus on bulk:
252+ Atk Arcanine Flare Blitz vs. 244 HP / 100 Def Celesteela: 180-212 (88.6 - 104.4%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Arcanine Burn Up vs. 244 HP / 164+ SpD Celesteela: 158-188 (77.8 - 92.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 244 HP / 164+ SpD Celesteela in Electric Terrain: 190-226 (93.5 - 111.3%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 244 HP / 164+ SpD Celesteela: 127-151 (62.5 - 74.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Ninetales-Alola Blizzard vs. 244 HP / 164+ SpD Celesteela: 40-48 (19.7 - 23.6%) -- possible 5HKO after hail damage and Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Garchomp Fire Fang vs. 244 HP / 100 Def Celesteela: 68-80 (33.4 - 39.4%) -- 13.8% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Xurkitree Thunderbolt vs. 244 HP / 164+ SpD Celesteela: 162-192 (79.8 - 94.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery


After a Beast Boost:
252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. +1 244 HP / 164+ SpD Celesteela: 86-101 (42.3 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Offensive presence even with no attacking EVs:
0 Atk Celesteela Heavy Slam (120 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 78-93 (53.4 - 63.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 SpA Celesteela Flamethrower vs. 84 HP / 164 SpD Assault Vest Kartana: 160-192 (110.3 - 132.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO


Celesteela is definitely a star player on my team, no other Ultra Beast save for Xurkitree poses a threat to it, it can wall others for days, out of all my teams Celesteela was always present, that should show how useful it has been



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Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Download
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 156 Def / 108 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk/0 Speed
- Tri Attack
- Ice Beam
- Recover
- Trick Room

Porygon2 is for Trick Room control, it also poses significant bulk and can be very disruptive to my opponent.
Ice Beam is for Garchomp and the rare Salamence,Tri Attack is for STAB, after a Download boost it hits relatively hard. Recover because it's a very stally Pokemon so keeping it in play is essential. And Trick Room for speed control.

Defensive:
252+ Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. 244 HP / 156 Def Eviolite Porygon2: 156-186 (81.6 - 97.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Pheromosa Focus Blast vs. 244 HP / 108+ SpD Eviolite Porygon2: 134-158 (70.1 - 82.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Arcanine Flare Blitz vs. 244 HP / 156 Def Eviolite Porygon2: 63-75 (32.9 - 39.2%) -- 99.8% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Arcanine Close Combat vs. 244 HP / 156 Def Eviolite Porygon2: 84-100 (43.9 - 52.3%) -- 16% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Xurkitree Thunderbolt vs. 244 HP / 108+ SpD Eviolite Porygon2 in Electric Terrain: 91-108 (47.6 - 56.5%) -- 82% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 244 HP / 108+ SpD Eviolite Porygon2 in Electric Terrain: 70-83 (36.6 - 43.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO


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Garchomp @ Groundium Z
Ability: Rough Skin
Level: 50
EVs: 92 HP / 92 Atk / 4 Def / 108 SpD / 212 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Poison Jab
- Fire Fang
- Protect


Slightly bulky Garchomp set which explains the EVs, Earthquake is for Koko, Alola-Muk, Nihilego, Torkoal, Gigalith, Arcanine
Poison Jab is for Fairies and the odd Grass type like Lilligant.
Fire Fang is almost exclusively for Kartana.
Protect for protections against Blizzards while I try neutralize the Ice type with Celesteela.

Groundium Z because -1 EQs on Arcanine never OHKO, Alola-Muk is too bulky same goes for Torkoal and Gigalith


252+ SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Hidden Power Ice vs. 92 HP / 108 SpD Garchomp: 161-192 (82.5 - 98.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Dazzling Gleam vs. 92 HP / 108 SpD Garchomp: 159-190 (81.5 - 97.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO [Single target]
252 SpA Tapu Lele Moonblast vs. 92 HP / 108 SpD Garchomp: 164-194 (84.1 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
28+ SpA Porygon2 Ice Beam vs. 92 HP / 108 SpD Garchomp: 160-192 (82 - 98.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
212 EVs outspeeds Timid Xurkitree by 1 point)
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Tapu Fini @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Misty Surge
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 64 Def / 100 SpA / 100 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Muddy Water
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Protect


Fini is my answer to Arcanine and Garchomp which are everywhere at the moment, it isn't very strong but has decent bulk to set up and provide chip damage.
It deals with the odd A-Marowak and completely walls any Dragon not named Garchomp, even then Moonblast poses a threat. EVs focus on general bulk
252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Discharge vs. 244 HP / 100+ SpD Tapu Fini: 70-86 (39.7 - 48.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Sitrus Berry recovery
252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 244 HP / 100+ SpD Tapu Fini: 109-133 (61.9 - 75.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Sitrus Berry recovery
100 SpA Tapu Fini Moonblast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Tapu Koko: 73-87 (50 - 59.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
100 SpA Tapu Fini Muddy Water vs. 252 HP / 156 SpD Marowak-Alola: 84-98 (50.2 - 58.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


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Tapu Koko @ Focus Sash
Ability: Electric Surge
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Speed
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Protect
- Dazzling Gleam
- Thunderbolt
- Discharge

My team needed some fast power, Koko isn't the fastest in the meta at the moment but it's typing is by far the kindest of the fast VGC mons, with Koko I threaten Pheramosa, Tapu Fini and Garchomp, as well as anything such as Celesteela and Mandibuzz, Sash ensures that I cannot be one shotted by Z-Moves, Poison moves or Ground moves,
EVs and moves are generic sweeping set, only difference is the sash as opposed to Life Orb and I think it works better.



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Goodra @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sap Sipper
Level: 50
EVs: 188 HP / 164 Def / 156 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Muddy Water
- Flamethrower
- Sludge Bomb
- Dragon Pulse


After my many many losses I started seeing Tapu Fini, Arcanine and Garchomp in my nightmares, all the Tapus at the moment really, but the first 3 Pokemon in particular.
So I must have scanned the Pokedex and Internet for a good hour solid looking for something that threatens all of them and resists them too, and the ones it doesn't resist does it have bulk to not be OHKo'd
Then it hit me to use Goodra, it's strong, incredibly specially bulky and very good defensive typing seeing as the VGC17 metagame lacks physical Fairies and Ice types. It laughs at Alola-Ninetales Blizzards, at Tapu Koko's Dazzling Gleam and Fini's Moonblast, it walls Arcanine and Tapu Bulu for days and it's move pool makes it able to do hit everything for super effective damage, it was perfect.

Muddy Water is for Arcanine, Mudsdale, Torkoal and Alola-Marowak
Flamethrower is for Kartana
Sludge Bomb is for all the Tapu's and Alola-Ninetales
Dragon Pulse is for STAB, it 2HKOs Garchomp, Misty Terrain is an issue though, and it's my only resort when matched with something that the moveset doesn't cover.

The EVs are suggested Smogon set,

252+ SpA Tapu Lele Moonblast vs. 188 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 84-102 (44.4 - 53.9%) -- 23.4% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Tapu Lele Dazzling Gleam vs. 188 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 54-66 (28.5 - 34.9%) -- 1.9% chance to 3HKO
252+ SpA Tapu Fini Moonblast vs. 188 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 68-84 (35.9 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Dazzling Gleam vs. 188 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 49-62 (25.9 - 32.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 188 HP / 164 Def Goodra: 69-82 (36.5 - 43.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 188 HP / 164 Def Goodra in Misty Terrain: 72-86 (38 - 45.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO


All in all guys, that is my team, it's worked well for me but if I had to make a change it would be for Porygon2, most Downloads I get are to Attack and without a SpA boost Porygon2 hits like drunk dog.
The only use I get out of it on the higher ladders is threatening Garchomp with Ice Beam.

[Marcusube]

This looks like a solid team for the metagame. Currently, with Arcanine, Garchomp, Tapu Fini, Muk-A and Tapu Lele being the most seen Pokemon used, this team surely has great checks to all.

The type synergy is also very solid with the 'Celesteela + Garchomp + Tapu Fini' core you have going on.

Porygon2 seems to just be sitting here on the team to further help with Celesteela's stall. For a decently speedy team like this, is Trick Room really necessary?

[MDofTheK]

(Feb 16, 2017, 06:23 AM)Marcusube Wrote: This looks like a solid team for the metagame. Currently, with Arcanine, Garchomp, Tapu Fini, Muk-A and Tapu Lele being the most seen Pokemon used, this team surely has great checks to all.

The type synergy is also very solid with the 'Celesteela + Garchomp + Tapu Fini' core you have going on.

Porygon2 seems to just be sitting here on the team to further help with Celesteela's stall. For a decently speedy team like this, is Trick Room really necessary?

Thanks, I am especially proud of Goodra.

Porygon2 is easily the most expendable member of my team, I guess the only reason it has stuck around so long is because it decimates Garchomp with Ice Beam, Trick Room is more for opposing TR teams I guess, less so for my team to make use of it. But if you had to trade Porgon2 in what would you suggest? My team seems to still suffer against bulky Pokemon like Snorlax and Porygon2 so I am unsure what I could replace it with

[Rockycombo]

If you're looking to replace P2, Gigalith might not be a bad idea. That would give you an answer to any opposing weather, while syngerizing decently well with at least Garchomp and Celesteela. Though it might be counter productive with your Koko's Focus Sash. But Gigalith would resist Snorlax and P2's main STAB and has decent enough defense to survive all they could throw at you but a Belly Drum boosted High Horsepower (and if you throw a weakness policy on it, any other High Horsepower would just help you). Just a thought, though it may take some adjustment in your team.

[MDofTheK]

(Feb 16, 2017, 08:04 AM)Rockycombo Wrote: If you're looking to replace P2, Gigalith might not be a bad idea. That would give you an answer to any opposing weather, while syngerizing decently well with at least Garchomp and Celesteela. Though it might be counter productive with your Koko's Focus Sash. But Gigalith would resist Snorlax and P2's main STAB and has decent enough defense to survive all they could throw at you but a Belly Drum boosted High Horsepower (and if you throw a weakness policy on it, any other High Horsepower would just help you). Just a thought, though it may take some adjustment in your team.

Thanks for the suggestion

I have experimented with Gigalith but it's too slow and not strong enough to reliably counter Porygon2 since it can easily Recover the HP lost.

I was pondering if maybe I should add Hariyama, gives me Fake Out or even Wide Guard options, Close Combat can destroy tanky walls, Knock Off can be be disruptive, status wouldn't cripple it.

It's all just a theory for now.

[Black117]

As is, the team looks relatively strong on paper though one of the things I feel this team lacks such as a strong offensive pressure and a response to opposing Ice- and Fairy-type Pokemon, though not sure if Celesteela is enough. Looking at the team, it doesn't really have a strong 'nuke' option aside Garchomp's Techonic Rage Earthquake or boosted CM Fini, which really depends on the matchup and if Fini can get boosted. Definitely the team cores are strong, but the main concern is the lack of offensive pressure as your team needs a couple Pokemon who can at least immediate threaten the opposing threats. Here are some suggestions, though totally up to you if these are appropriate or not.

If you are considering replacing P2, why not just add Curse Snorlax into the mix as it gives the team another strong win condition to use and a viable response to Trick Room. The moveset can be based on 13Yoshi37's set with Return, High Horsepower, Curse, and Recycle which technically has pseudo recovery with the 50% berries and Gluttony. Another thought about this is Snorlax's bulk is capable of withstanding most of the strong Z-attacks in the game and attempt to setup Curses for the endgame. The only thing that worries Snorlax are notably powerful Fighting-type Pokemon, and just heavy offensive pressure in general, but your team at least has other mons who can support the Snorlax setup.

Honestly, specially defensive Celesteela with Flamethrower is honestly the best variant atm given the potential to raise its Special Defense to take Special Attacks better and to check opposing Steel-types notably Kartana and other Celesteelas. The EV Spread can be modified around, though not sure as to what, though there's not much to say about Celesteela anyways.

Tapu Fini is definitely a good call to have with this team, though the item choice is up for debate. My main concern is whether Tapu Fini needs Leftovers from Celesteela since it can really benefit from the long term setup. If you want those leftovers, then for Celesteela it can run Misty Seed to gain a +1 Special Defense, though it requires both mons in the same team matchup. The 50% Berries can also suffice for either Celesteela / Tapu Fini, but it has to be activated around the 25% mark HP. If you feel as though Tapu Fini needs more damage output, well you can always try Choice Specs to get more damage output.

Sash Tapu Koko is something I don't see often, though if your team wants more damage output, I'd Suggest you try out a Life Orb or Electrium-Z set. Do feel as though Discharge can be replaced for either Taunt, HP Ice, or Volt Switch, again it depends on your team's needs. Will say Sash Tapu Koko, Porygon2/Snorlax, Fini, and Celesteela is more than enough to handle opposing Rain teams.

Adamant Garchomp is an interesting call given you lose out in outspeeding Tapu Lele / Arcanine in exchange for a better stat distribution for a bulkier EV Spread as mentioned. Just a thought, if you still feel the team doesn't apply offensive pressure, then maybe Sword Dance can be utilize to threaten opposing teams with a +2 Z Earthquake or Fire Fang for opposing Steel-types.

Goodra is somewhat standard, but the EV Spread is good enough to handle opposing weather-based teams and Tapus. Not sure why you want to have Muddy Water here when you can use Goodra's coverage options like Thunderbolt, which can potentially get boosted by Koko's Electric Terrain. Thunderbolt on Goodra along allows it to at least handle opposing Rain teams well. Since Fini is on this team, Dragon-type damage will be halved so maybe either replace Dragon Pulse for Thunderbolt/Ice Beam), or run Dragon Tail (yes Dragon Tail) to 1) phaze out setup attackers, and 2) remove the Trick Room setters. Of Course Goodra can't hit things like Whimsicott or Mimikyu, but at least this allows your team to combat setup.

Well that's about it. I'll leave the suggested sets for Snorlax and Tapu Fini below.

PS: Do feel like Arcanine can fit on this team for intimidate support and to combat Fairy/Ice-type Pokemon.

Snorlax (M) @ Figy Berry
Ability: Gluttony
Level: 50
EVs: 68 HP / 76 Atk / 228 Def / 132 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Return
- High Horsepower
- Curse
- Recycle

Tapu Fini @ Choice Specs
Ability: Misty Surge
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 84 SpA / 44 SpD / 28 Spe
IVs: 0 Atk
- Muddy Water
- Dazzling Gleam
- Moonblast
- Hydro Pump

[MDofTheK]

(Feb 17, 2017, 01:56 PM)Black117 Wrote: As is, the team looks relatively strong on paper though one of the things I feel this team lacks such as a strong offensive pressure and a response to opposing Ice- and Fairy-type Pokemon, though not sure if Celesteela is enough. Looking at the team, it doesn't really have a strong 'nuke' option aside Garchomp's Techonic Rage Earthquake or boosted CM Fini, which really depends on the matchup and if Fini can get boosted. Definitely the team cores are strong, but the main concern is the lack of offensive pressure as your team needs a couple Pokemon who can at least immediate threaten the opposing threats. Here are some suggestions, though totally up to you if these are appropriate or not.

If you are considering replacing P2, why not just add Curse Snorlax into the mix as it gives the team another strong win condition to use and a viable response to Trick Room. The moveset can be based on 13Yoshi37's set with Return, High Horsepower, Curse, and Recycle which technically has pseudo recovery with the 50% berries and Gluttony. Another thought about this is Snorlax's bulk is capable of withstanding most of the strong Z-attacks in the game and attempt to setup Curses for the endgame. The only thing that worries Snorlax are notably powerful Fighting-type Pokemon, and just heavy offensive pressure in general, but your team at least has other mons who can support the Snorlax setup.

Honestly, specially defensive Celesteela with Flamethrower is honestly the best variant atm given the potential to raise its Special Defense to take Special Attacks better and to check opposing Steel-types notably Kartana and other Celesteelas. The EV Spread can be modified around, though not sure as to what, though there's not much to say about Celesteela anyways.

Tapu Fini is definitely a good call to have with this team, though the item choice is up for debate. My main concern is whether Tapu Fini needs Leftovers from Celesteela since it can really benefit from the long term setup. If you want those leftovers, then for Celesteela it can run Misty Seed to gain a +1 Special Defense, though it requires both mons in the same team matchup. The 50% Berries can also suffice for either Celesteela / Tapu Fini, but it has to be activated around the 25% mark HP. If you feel as though Tapu Fini needs more damage output, well you can always try Choice Specs to get more damage output.

Sash Tapu Koko is something I don't see often, though if your team wants more damage output, I'd Suggest you try out a Life Orb or Electrium-Z set. Do feel as though Discharge can be replaced for either Taunt, HP Ice, or Volt Switch, again it depends on your team's needs. Will say Sash Tapu Koko, Porygon2/Snorlax, Fini, and Celesteela is more than enough to handle opposing Rain teams.

Adamant Garchomp is an interesting call given you lose out in outspeeding Tapu Lele / Arcanine in exchange for a better stat distribution for a bulkier EV Spread as mentioned. Just a thought, if you still feel the team doesn't apply offensive pressure, then maybe Sword Dance can be utilize to threaten opposing teams with a +2 Z Earthquake or Fire Fang for opposing Steel-types.

Goodra is somewhat standard, but the EV Spread is good enough to handle opposing weather-based teams and Tapus. Not sure why you want to have Muddy Water here when you can use Goodra's coverage options like Thunderbolt, which can potentially get boosted by Koko's Electric Terrain. Thunderbolt on Goodra along allows it to at least handle opposing Rain teams well. Since Fini is on this team, Dragon-type damage will be halved so maybe either replace Dragon Pulse for Thunderbolt/Ice Beam), or run Dragon Tail (yes Dragon Tail) to 1) phaze out setup attackers, and 2) remove the Trick Room setters. Of Course Goodra can't hit things like Whimsicott or Mimikyu, but at least this allows your team to combat setup.

Well that's about it. I'll leave the suggested sets for Snorlax and Tapu Fini below.

PS: Do feel like Arcanine can fit on this team for intimidate support and to combat Fairy/Ice-type Pokemon.

Snorlax (M) @ Figy Berry
Ability: Gluttony
Level: 50
EVs: 68 HP / 76 Atk / 228 Def / 132 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Return
- High Horsepower
- Curse
- Recycle

Tapu Fini @ Choice Specs
Ability: Misty Surge
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 84 SpA / 44 SpD / 28 Spe
IVs: 0 Atk
- Muddy Water
- Dazzling Gleam
- Moonblast
- Hydro Pump

Thanks for the rate, I really like your suggestion of Snorlax, and Fini definitely needs some reworking, I might go with your suggested Specs set or I might adopt Wolfe Glick's cleric set, using Swagger and Misty Terrain to boost Snorlax and Garchomp, I feel that Calm Mind on Fini is great but it's only really useful if it has Leftovers as well as Aurora Veil support since super effective hits like Wild Charge Arcanine or Tapu Koko can 2HKO it easy