Feb 16, 2016, 05:08 AM (This post was last modified: Feb 17, 2016, 07:01 PM by Apo.
Edit Reason: blop
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When you choose a Pokemon, you need to set clear goals for what they will have to do. It seems like you tried to give too much work to your Groudon and your Xerneas:
-Giving Iron Head to Groudon so he can OHKO Xerneas: I don't think it is Groudon's job to do tho. Moreover, Groudon can already deal with Xerneas, not OHKO tho.
-Giving Hidden Power Ground to Xerneas so it can deal with Groudon: same thing, I don't think it is Xerneas's Job to deal with Groudon. Besides, Hidden Power is weak (60 power) and not STAB (90% chance to 2HKO Groudon with 4 HP EV) meaning you would need Geomancy set up, else it could mean you sacrifice your Xerneas for Groudon, do you want that?
-Thundurus to counter Kyogre: you have Ferrothorn who does that way better
It's a good start! My advice would be to switch out the Thundurus and Terrakion, and replace a number of moves. If thundurus' role is to get KO's on kyogre, you already have a ferrothorn to do so (replacing seed bomb with power whip, you'll really want the power), there's not much of a point to it. A couple interesting VGC16 choices ago, my first team of the season had Leafeon for that exact purpose, but it did not get me that far. Terrakion might be a good Kang counter, but im not confident in the dent it can leave in the rest of the meta. Not a lot of fighting type pokemon in general are being used, even the usually present Conkeldurr. It's tempting to land something STAB-SuperEffective, but there are many other ways to deal Kangaskhan massive damage without having a fragile pokemon invested on specifically taking it out. I would at least replace your thundurus with it's other bulkier form and set, taking advantage of prankster and tbolt doing decent enough damage on kyogre. Kangaskhan could have Low Kick instead of protect to take out other Kang's and the terrakion slot could be something entirely different, according to the needs of your team.
I think if you want to do a speedy groudon you should go all the way. Maybe replace it's iron head for rock polish so it can blitz through things that used to outspeed. In any case the previous quote about it not needing iron head is true. It can neutral damage xerneas to death and only is threatened by it having hidden power after it gets geomancy off. Plus it can counter other groudons if it can get it's polish off before they come in with that guarantee'd outspeed.
It's also correct that you need some speed control. Especially since you're running max speed on everything bar ferrothorn. Get some icy wind or electro web or something in there. I'd say that other thundurus would be better for you as it could secondary t. wave with ferrothorn. It could also taunt incoming trick rooms, which is something you should really keep in mind cause there's some bros out there with mad trick room game. If someone is able to get a bulky character in and trick room on you, especially after xerneas' geomancy speed comes into play, you could lose all your momentum and burn out.
(Feb 16, 2016, 02:13 PM)El Miguel VGC Wrote: It's a good start! My advice would be to switch out the Thundurus and Terrakion, and replace a number of moves. If thundurus' role is to get KO's on kyogre, you already have a ferrothorn to do so (replacing seed bomb with power whip, you'll really want the power), there's not much of a point to it. A couple interesting VGC16 choices ago, my first team of the season had Leafeon for that exact purpose, but it did not get me that far. Terrakion might be a good Kang counter, but im not confident in the dent it can leave in the rest of the meta. Not a lot of fighting type pokemon in general are being used, even the usually present Conkeldurr. It's tempting to land something STAB-SuperEffective, but there are many other ways to deal Kangaskhan massive damage without having a fragile pokemon invested on specifically taking it out. I would at least replace your thundurus with it's other bulkier form and set, taking advantage of prankster and tbolt doing decent enough damage on kyogre. Kangaskhan could have Low Kick instead of protect to take out other Kang's and the terrakion slot could be something entirely different, according to the needs of your team.
I agree with Miguel. Maybe you already know about showdown, you should test your team there, to see what facets of your team need improvement. Regarding the HP-Ground, I used it myself, not just for groudon but also for other pesky steel types. I thought it could help against the thorns but it doesn't knock it out, I'm considering HP-Fire now, or a new partner to deal with it aside from groudon.
(Feb 16, 2016, 02:13 PM)El Miguel VGC Wrote: It's a good start! My advice would be to switch out the Thundurus and Terrakion, and replace a number of moves. If thundurus' role is to get KO's on kyogre, you already have a ferrothorn to do so (replacing seed bomb with power whip, you'll really want the power), there's not much of a point to it. A couple interesting VGC16 choices ago, my first team of the season had Leafeon for that exact purpose, but it did not get me that far. Terrakion might be a good Kang counter, but im not confident in the dent it can leave in the rest of the meta. Not a lot of fighting type pokemon in general are being used, even the usually present Conkeldurr. It's tempting to land something STAB-SuperEffective, but there are many other ways to deal Kangaskhan massive damage without having a fragile pokemon invested on specifically taking it out. I would at least replace your thundurus with it's other bulkier form and set, taking advantage of prankster and tbolt doing decent enough damage on kyogre. Kangaskhan could have Low Kick instead of protect to take out other Kang's and the terrakion slot could be something entirely different, according to the needs of your team.
I agree with Miguel. Maybe you already know about showdown, you should test your team there, to see what facets of your team need improvement. Regarding the HP-Ground, I used it myself, not just for groudon but also for other pesky steel types. I thought it could help against the thorns but it doesn't knock it out, I'm considering HP-Fire now, or a new partner to deal with it aside from groudon.
I literally copied the team from my showdown. I was gonna get rid of the terrakion because its literally a sitting duck and is only good when there is a kang about. As for the Thundy I may replace it with either cress or crobat for speed control. I'm not 100% sure about the terrakion. Maybe an amoonguss for redirect or something.
252 Atk Primal Groudon Iron Head vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Xerneas: 124-146 (61.6 - 72.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Primal Groudon Fire Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Xerneas in Harsh Sun: 129-153 (64.1 - 76.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
You get the gist of what I'm saying. Iron Head doesn't OHKO Xerneas plus Fire Punch does more in general.
What do the 8 EVs in Defense achieve?
On Kangaskhan, scrap either Fake Out or Protect for Low Kick. You will need it for combating common Steels such as Dialga and Ferrothorn.
As mentioned before, Ferrothorn pressures Kyogre with a potential KO in Power Whip so the niche you need Thundurus-T to perform is redundant.
Terrakion doesn't work in this metagame. Scrap it. And the term "standard Kang counter" already shows that you're approaching the meta incorrectly. Formulate a strategy that you like and build your team based on that. Reacting against the meta only sets you behind because day by day it is advancing meaning the reactive function of your team eventually pushes it in the non-viable category.
HP Ground doesn't deal with Groudon
+2 252 SpA Xerneas Hidden Power Ground vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Primal Groudon: 150-178 (85.7 - 101.7%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
This is, by the way, contingent on if Groudon isn't a bulky variant.
