Apr 1, 2015, 08:31 PM (This post was last modified: Apr 2, 2015, 10:09 AM by iflytoohigh.)
[Edit #1 - Replaced Toxic with Confuse Ray on Ninetails. Also dropping Tyrantrum, but haven't decided what will be the replacement yet.]
You guys! I did it! I made my first sun team, and with a LOT of support and assistance, I won my first Battle Spot match with it!
Now, I recognize that I still have a LONG way to go in terms of improving my team building and prediction skills, but I was so surprised and excited about this win, especially because the first round/turn was immensely demoralizing for me when I let Ninetails become incapacitated. T^T I just wanted to give up after that, but I didn't! (Who knew that battling could be so intense and emotional!?)
At any rate, I'll share my team with you guys, as well as the VS Recorder code. I'd love it if some of you could give me more honest and constructive feedback so that I can continue to tweak this team to perform even better. It took me so long to put it together, between running a bajillion damage calculations and checking myself for weaknesses and strengths on Team Magma's team builder. @~@ I don't know how some of you just throw teams together with such ease! I was drained following the 5-6 hours it took me to do this, plus the several practice matches that helped me determine what moves I wanted to switch up and play around with a little more.
Thanks again to all of you (GMX, Marcusube, Black117, KevMan, z2porygon, and Vexian) who provided so much support and help to me so far. I feel really bad for taking up so much of people's time, but do know that I have immensely appreciated it.
Okay, before this starts to sound like an awards ceremony speech (maybe someday, amirite!? :P), here's my noob team + VS Recorder code: FLXG-WWWW-WWXP-F4UR
Cherrim w/ Big Root
Ability: Flower Gift
Nature: Impish
EVs: 252 HP / 216 Defense / 12 Special Defense / 28 Speed
- Helping Hand
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Return
Okay, there it is! I realize that this team is somewhat all over the place, but I feel like it does a decent job as long as I'm playing offensively. When I first started practicing with it, I was playing too cautiously, and I wasn't having a very good time. But, it seems like being the aggressor works with this sort of lineup. I'm sure there may be a better Pokémon to fill Tyrantrum's slot (I was thinking about a bulky water Pokémon, but I'm still not sure), but I reached my IDGAF point after hitting the 5 hour mark and slapped it on there. It hasn't been super dead weight yet, but as I've already said, I'm absolutely open to dropping her.
Thanks so much again, everyone! I've only won one battle, but you don't even understand how happy this one win has made me. I hope I can have many more!
Good job! And to think i get nervous if i don't win 2 out of 3 games on BP.. i guess i don't have your patience, but i appreciate your will to improve and the effort you are putting in this.
#Cherrim
I like the Big Root + Leech Seed idea, while i don't get the point of running Return (which btw requires max happiness too) instead of Energy Ball or Giga Drain (maybe you were too lazy to breed a Bold nature? :D)
#Ninetales
Toxic is not ideal in VGC since you can't really stall as in singles where you just face one opponent at a time. I can understand Heat Rock, since you want the sunlight to stay as much as possible. Ninetales has access to Confuse Ray, Pain Split, Charm/Confide/Baby-Doll Eyes too.
#M-Pidgeot
I'll quote the description of Hurricane (move): "it has 50% accuracy during intense sunlight". I don't know if it's worth it to use Mega Pidgeot in sun teams.
#Excadrill
I like Excadrill because of Mold Breaker and its fantastic Stabs, but i think this pokemon belongs to Sand teams more then to Sun ones. Howewer it can work since it checks Sylveon and CharY.
#Tyrantrum
Scarf Tyrantrum can surprise your opponent picking fast KOs, but it has the same role as Excadrill, so i would change it as you said.
#Meowstic
Meowstic is another support pokemon along with Cherrim, which has a different support movepool, yes, but they can't bring offensive pressure on the opponent so you might want only one of them or you will be unable to literally KO your opponent's pokemon (plus, they can't bring a good overall coverage)
Now you must choose between fixing your current team (moves, Ev spreads) or trying to improve it (at the cost of changing 2 or even 3 pokemons in your team - and i already have something in mind)
On Ninetales, I would scrap Toxic for Solar Beam. It might not be stab, but at least this way, you have a way of dealing with Suicune and other bulky water types.
as stated above, Excadrill and Tyrantrum don't need to be on the same team. I would replace Tyrantrum for another pokemon who can hit with an ice type attack. Maybe Conkeldurr with Mach Punch, Drain Punch, Ice Punch, and Knock Off? It does give that much needed clutch priority move for your team. Up to you though
Hmm, I am not against running 2 mostly supportive pokemon. They both seem to have a role so I won't say much about Cherrim and Meowstic.
(Apr 2, 2015, 07:24 AM)Chimchared7 Wrote: if i were you i would just run willo wisp not toxic
Thanks for the feedback! I'm going to look into alternatives to Toxic and switch that out. ^^
(Apr 2, 2015, 07:39 AM)GMX Wrote: Good job! And to think i get nervous if i don't win 2 out of 3 games on BP.. i guess i don't have your patience, but i appreciate your will to improve and the effort you are putting in this.
#Cherrim
I like the Big Root + Leech Seed idea, while i don't get the point of running Return (which btw requires max happiness too) instead of Energy Ball or Giga Drain (maybe you were too lazy to breed a Bold nature? :D)
#Ninetales
Toxic is not ideal in VGC since you can't really stall as in singles where you just face one opponent at a time. I can understand Heat Rock, since you want the sunlight to stay as much as possible. Ninetales has access to Confuse Ray, Pain Split, Charm/Confide/Baby-Doll Eyes too.
#M-Pidgeot
I'll quote the description of Hurricane (move): "it has 50% accuracy during intense sunlight". I don't know if it's worth it to use Mega Pidgeot in sun teams.
#Excadrill
I like Excadrill because of Mold Breaker and its fantastic Stabs, but i think this pokemon belongs to Sand teams more then to Sun ones. Howewer it can work since it checks Sylveon and CharY.
#Tyrantrum
Scarf Tyrantrum can surprise your opponent picking fast KOs, but it has the same role as Excadrill, so i would change it as you said.
#Meowstic
Meowstic is another support pokemon along with Cherrim, which has a different support movepool, yes, but they can't bring offensive pressure on the opponent so you might want only one of them or you will be unable to literally KO your opponent's pokemon (plus, they can't bring a good overall coverage)
Now you must choose between fixing your current team (moves, Ev spreads) or trying to improve it (at the cost of changing 2 or even 3 pokemons in your team - and i already have something in mind)
Thanks for such a detailed response, GMX! I'll reply to each of your points in order.
#Cherrim - I opted for Return (my happiness is maxed with it), because I thought it'd be the safest way of negating Taunt, plus I figured it would do at least a decent amount of neutral damage to multiple Pokémon, as opposed to bringing a STAB attack that may not be effective against some enemies. If you think I should prioritize Energy Ball or Giga Drain, it's no problem for me to switch that up. I'll play around with it!
#Ninetails - You're right about Toxic being iffy. Out of all the practice matches that I used this Pokémon, I think I only ever cast Toxic once. Confuse Ray sounds like a better choice, so I'll be sure to make this adjustment ASAP.
#Mega Pidgeot - I was hoping Mega Pidgeot would fit, but perhaps Hurricane isn't the right choice. I do still have my Mega Medicham from the previous team I was working on... I think it could work, so I may swap them. Again, I'll play with this some more and see how things go. What do you think?
Medicham w/ Medichamite
Ability: Pure Power
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Attack / 252 Speed
- Fake Out
- Drain Punch
- Thunder Punch
- Psycho Cut
#Excadrill and Tyrantrum - Yeah, as we both have noted, these two Pokémon fill the same role on this team. I'm just struggling to decide what to pick up to replace Tyrantrum. I was considering Blastoise, but someone said that perhaps my Empoleon from my previous team might work. I'm not so sure. What do you think?
Empoleon w/ Assault Vest
Ability: Defiant
Nature: Quiet
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Attack / 52 Defense / 148 Special Attack / 52 Special Defense
- Flash Cannon
- Knock Off
- Icy Wind
- Scald
#Meowstic - I had opted to tack on my Meowstic as sort of backup for those situations where running my sun team may not be ideal. I figured it did a decent job of serving as an all-around support for those non-sun inspired battles. But, maybe it is better to opt for a different support that also brings a bit of offense capabilities and poses more of a threat. I'll eyeball some replacement options, but holy cow is breeding a pain in the ***.
Thanks again for all of the feedback! I'll be tweaking my team this evening to reflect many of your suggestions.
On Ninetales, I would scrap Toxic for Solar Beam. It might not be stab, but at least this way, you have a waymof dealing with Suicune and other bulky water types.
as stated above, Excadrill and Tyrantrum don't need to be on the same team. I would replace Tyrantrum for another pokemon who can hit with an ice type attack. Maybe Conkeldurr with Mach Punch, Drain Punch, Ice Punch, and Knock Off? It does give that much jeeded clutch priority move for your team. Up to you though
Hmm, I am not against running 2 mostly supportive pokemon. They both seem to have a role so I won't say much about Cherrim and Meowstic.
Nice battle by the way
Hi, Vietflame!
Thanks for the feedback on Hurricane! I hadn't noticed any issues with it casting, but you're right about No Guard ensuring that it always lands. Looks like Mega Pidgeot can stay!
Yeah, I'm already making a list of things to replace Toxic. Solar Beam is a nice suggestion! I'm not at home right now to mess around with it, but I will absolutely be changing Toxic. Thanks for reinforcing that it was a bad choice that needs to go.
Oh, Conkeldurr isn't a bad idea! I hadn't even considered it. Thank you for the recommendation! I'll do some rotating and tweaking this evening to the team, and I'll see how a Conkeldurr would fit. ^^ I think it's pretty much unanimous amongst us all that Tyrantrum needs to go.
Thank you for taking the time to leave me suggestions!
Lol @ iflytoohigh, I have to give it to you. Your posts are among the most entertaining to read here, haha. You seem like an incredibly quirky person and that isn't a bad thing. If the whole competitive pokemon thing doesn't work out for you or you lost interest, you could always consider picking up commentating or blogging. You strike me as the kind of person that would be very amusing to an audience.
Now about your team. I think it looks good! I'm a little late to the party and see that others have already made awesome critiques that you've applied but I'll still put some things out there.
Ninetails definitely needs to drop Toxic. I like the idea of Confuse Ray if you're looking for another disruptive ability. Looks like you're set here.
Tyrantrum is definitely the weakest link in your group. Although your Empoleon could work, how about Cloyster? You could do something like
Cloyster @ King's Rock
Ability: Skill Link
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
- Icicle Spear
- Rock Blast
- Explosion
- Toxic Spikes
In my opinion this would be a great replacement for Tyrantrum. But it is up to you if you don't feel like breeding, Empoleon can just be a temporary placeholder. I think the Cloyster pick would be superior of course.
Great first battle with this team, looks like you managed to get your opponent to forfeit due to your awesome power. Looks like you are slowly gaining momentum here regarding your skills. Looking forward to seeing what your final team looks like plus more future battles from you. It'd be nice to see you document your journey and share with everyone.
I completely forgot about No Guard ability, that's why Hurricane always connects, sorry for the mistake :/
My idea is to start from the Ninetales, Cherrim, Excadrill core and replace Mega Pidgeot with Mega Lopunny, Tyrantrum with Latios and Meowstic with Rotom-W.
Ninetales should have Flame Plate (to avoid Life Orb recoil damage since you already have Flare Blitz recoil)
Excadrill should have Choice Scarf to get surprise KOs on Terrakion, Timid CharY and M-Gardevoir.
First of all, Mega Lopunny is fast and hits everything at least for neutral damage, it can OHKO M-Kang with Low Kick and it has access to Fake Out (..and i think you really like Lopunny :D)
Latios provides Tailwind support, while hitting hard and fast too. Focus Sash is my choice because Latios is so frail, but you are guaranteed to setup Tailwind except if they double target your Latios. Ice Beam takes care of Landorus-T and Dragons, while Psyshock allows you to deal with M-Venusaur and Draco Meteor is a last choice move if you want to get massive damages before fainting, but you can run Protect if you feel like Ice Beam and Psyshock are enough. It has Levitate, which is important because you can use Earthquake with Excadrill.
Rotom-W is another Levitate user, which means you can spam Earthquake with Excadrill more often and you are still able to have a Electric/Water type on the field, which is fantastic since it covers 3 of the 4 weaknesses of Excadrill (Fire, Water, Ground). We can run a bulky support variant to get quite the same role as Meowstic (with Thunder Wave and Reflect)
I did it! My first sun team + Battle Spot victory!
